Twist rate on bullets is a debatemine is 1:7 on 9 barrel. I would go with the sig. The new RIA 5.0 Sporting Pistol from Rock Island Armory features a patented RVS Recoil system that maximizes barrel mass and linear movement to give shooters super soft recoil. I had several concerns due to its comically short barrel, its accuracy, reliability and velocity. PDWs are an established, in-between class of firearm. Comfortable to hold, the handguard offered the most versatility of our three rifles. I was really happy . Caliber: 300 AAC Blackout-MSRP: 1015. Barrel-twist rate was 1:8. My wife surprized me with a Birthday gift this year the new CZ TS2 Blue . Despite the unique internals, the MCXs controls are similar to a standard ARs, which helps because most shooters are familiar with the latters manual of arms. The new 9mm suppressor can mount easily to any pistol barrel threaded x28 inches and doesn't compromise on sound suppression, gas blowback or recoil. Bob Meinert, FN Marketing Director, introduces FN's first commercial pistol suppressor, the FN Rush 9Ti. To install (or remove for cleaning), you have to pop out both pins on the lower receiver and then slide the upper receiver back and forth. FN sells a 16-inch-barreled carbine version of the P90, the PS90, but it looks ugly and awkward and is far from compact. and the had the CZ Parrot checkmate 9mm $3,299. SIG MCX Rattler SBR . To get started, click the link below to visit mymagnow.com and learn how to access your digital magazine. Any ways I just bought the Springfield Saint Victor in .308 . Some big news for trigger pullers recently from the Civilian Marksmanship Program. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. To this end, the Protector boasts Wilsons excellent M2 two-state TTU trigger, factory set to between 4.5 to 5 pounds. To carry the Rattler discreetly, I used Eberlestocks Combat Office Brief, which represents a typical messenger bag, as well as several other covert packs in my inventory, including some camera bags. Whereas the SIG Sauer presented direct pressure against a solid object, the Saints trigger offered a subtle compression before reaching its breaking point. Using the Lehigh Defense ammunition, its a 50-yard rifle. Eric Poole and Tom Beckstrand test the Aimpoint Acro P-2 against one of red dot sights' biggest myths: distance. I used two suppressors with the Rattler. SIG Sauer MCX-SPEAR: Civilian Version of XM7 Rifle Arrives! I just started a new thread under Sig Rifles to cover Vrtus Patrol. Furthermore, Sig has a much higher percentage of parts and weapons produced in house, which allows them to control quality much more closely, where as Springfield assembles and builds only a fraction of their product line, AFAIK. I wrote SilencerCo to ask about the Hybrid compatibility. Both suppressors were more effective than, say, a flash suppressor or muzzle brake, but dont expect the gun to be as quiet as those shown in the movies. This may be true for some configurations, in certain environments, with particular loads. As to the tale of the tape, the gun has a 10.5-inch cold hammer-forged barrel (1:7 twist) and comes in at a very agile 5.8 pounds. I installed it on an AR carbine but ended up taking it off, because while it felt good in my hand, it just didnt look right to my eye. Brand: Springfield. The handguard does not have a rail on the top except for a very short section near the muzzle. For a company many people thought was years late to the AR party, Springfield Armory has done an amazing job in seizing a substantial percentage of the AR-15 marketplace, and theyre not slowing down. It has a cone-within-a-cup two-piece design reminiscent of the Noveske KX3. He called it a stutter. A staff member recently paid $2300 for a complete AR-15 carbine without regret. Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited. The only spot on the Rattler is its trigger. Don't wrestle with pigs, don't argue with idiots. Choice of ammunition for AR-15s used to be limited by the 1:9-inch-twist barrel. Profits before the 2A. I have not shot the Tread, I have handled and inspected it though. Additionally, the gun has one of the best brace systems going, a fast-deploying affair that cuts the size of the firearm nearly in half when folded in. SA ars get a lot of shit from people but it has been a really good rifle. Give a Gift Love my M400 Tread and if I was in the market for another AR Rifle, i'd absolutely consider it. The CMMGs single-finger-groove plastic grip is almost extinct because the divider can be uncomfortable and never really seems to be in the right place. Wed prefer a free-float sling attachment, but the Saint is handsome and well made at a good price. Probably 2k rounds through it and has always gone bang. All in, our CMMG rifle displayed 1-MOA accuracy on average for all shots fired, despite our difficulties with the trigger. I'm like seriously I could of got the checkmate . It also directs sound and blast forward, away from the shooter and provides some flash reduction. However, I ended up loving it for what it is. Knock off mp5 in 9mm I had a mpx pistol 3yrs ago and while funseems about 100% pointless knowing todays ballistic capabilities of the 556 &300. blbennett1288 Rivet. If we were to describe the bolt lock/release assembly as a seesaw, the typical lower end could be seen as being constructed without the seat. And After shooting the CZ 75 Tatical sport orange I was in love . From the 100-yard line, the Saint delivered 1.0-inch five-shot groups with the Black Hills 60-grain V-Max, 69-grain OTM rounds, and the 77-grain TMK ammunition. Can't wait to find the price on this and see one in person . Also visible with the top end hinged away was the Accu-Tite tension system consisting of a synthetic non-marring screw that mated flush beneath the bottom of the connecting lug. Purely on the rifle's features / traits wise, Update: im being told that both rifles are available for ~$1000 should I wait; i guess the extra $$$ is demand / price gouging for the saint. But there are a few key reasons why the .30-caliber is better suited for compact ARs. No, but it was never designed to be. Thank you for that information, I really needed to know that. Supporter+. We tend to the 7.5-inch SBA3 model, given its the rare smallster in the caliber that doesnt demand a kings ransom. Looks pretty sweet . At the range, my first order of business was zeroing the Rattler and shooting five-shot groups with it at 50 yards using loads from Barnes, Hornady, Lehigh Defense and Sig. But I will check out Sig's new Tread SE to see if I like it Yeah. Decibels dont drop like flies with every load. I was at a gun expo local set up by or LGS where all the repp's come and its a shoot day . It has a nickel boron coating and provides a single-stage trigger pull. The 300 rattler was designed to be suppressed. As our tests continued and the trigger broke in, we sometimes experienced only one stopping point before break. Instead of a GI-pattern charging handle, the PDW sports Springfields midsize charging handle, which is substantially larger than the GI model. Non-Lethal Personal & Home Defense with Byrna, Range Tested: EAA Girsan Pistols & Shotguns, New for 2023: Christensen Arms Modern Hunting Rifle (MHR), New for 2023: All-American RIA 5.0 Sporting Pistol, New for 2023: FN Rush 9Ti Pistol Suppressor, New Big Bore Pistols for 2023: FN 510 Tactical and FN 545 Tactical, New for 2023: FN SCAR 15P Rifle Caliber Pistol, First Look: Taurus Raging Hunter 460 Magnum Revolver With 10.5-Inch Barrel, New-for-2023 Taurus Judge Executive Grade 410/.45 Colt Revolver, Smith & Wesson Equalizer and the Brand New M&P 5.7 Pistol. For example, Ive seen U.S. Department of State Diplomatic Security Service special agents wielding them in the field when guarding high-value targets. The issue is, get it wrong, send a bullet yawling at the muzzle and youre contending with endcap and baffle strikes in your suppressor. The efficiency and versatility of barrels have been upgraded to take advantage of heavier bullets able to land a more effective blow at greater distance. AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. Minuteman. Target order was dictated as a circuit of left, center, right, left, center, right, and so on. I got it for around 900 dollars a little over a year ago. In fact, it wasnt that long ago that SIG was in a similar position. Sig Sauer M400 Tread .223/5.56 Semi-Automatic 30rd 16" I own and have experience in small arms and shotguns, so this will be an entry level AR for me. The first was the SilencerCo Omega 9K, which is only 4.7 inches long and weighs 7.2 ounces. Maybe i'll sell the .308 if they ship me a new replacement and get an M1A instead, but i'm not exactly dying to give that money right back to them after this fiasco. As to the brace, its a Tailhook Mod 2, an adjustable model that does an excellent job of settling in the gun. For a full answer to that, were going to have to explore exactly what a PDW is, but before I do that, lets look at the specs of this gun. Lets see if our money was well spent. What we came up with was three AR-15s with upgrades that distinguished them from more traditional models. About every 20 to 25 shots, the trigger would pull straight through. The buttstock was properly applied and showed only the slightest wiggle. *Bullet weight measured in grains, velocity in fps by chronograph and accuracy in inches for best 5-shot groups at 50 yards. This video does make me feel better about Springfield. Maximum bullet weight was considered to be 69 grains. As long as you are not expecting rifle-length performance out of a barrel this short, you wont be disappointed. With the Saint Edge series of ARs, you get nicely sculpted lower receivers machined from billet aluminum. Operating the trigger in a controlled press, the trigger seemed to find two stopping points before finally breaking a shot. The visual theme of the Saint was that it looks to be one piece instead of an upper and lower, or as some say, it looks monolithic. We applied a snap-on buttpad from Limbsaver and was pleasantly surprised at how much more comfortable it was to shoot. The art of shooting groups from support is about being patient. That saint victor is 400 above msrp though. I'm ashamed I even own one let alone was considering buying the Saint. Im knocking quite a few off my backlist to be sure. Barrel-twist rate was 1:7, and breaking down the rifle revealed a reduced-mass hammer. The free-floated handguard offered Keymod machining on three sides, and the Picatinny top rail extended 11 inches from the receiver. It may not display this or other websites correctly. That said, most of the 6.75" barrels shoot supers unsuppressed just fine. 4. That said, and this being Wilson, dont expect some off-the-rack experience with the gun. SAINT ARs come in a range of sizes and calibers. It opened up at about 3 inches and penetrated 12.7 inches, retaining 192.8 grains of its original bullet weight. Taylors & Company FS Tactical 1911: Now in 10mm! So was the grip and handguard. When I saw it, I wanted to hate it, specifically for what it isnt. Working the Saint trigger differed from that of the SIG Sauer. They screwed up, realize it, and took care of the problem. Working the charging handle was smooth and revealed no linear movement. The Springfield Armory Saint Edge PDW brings to mind a saying from Rush Limbaugh: Illustrating absurdity by being absurd. It offers, at least when compared to a standard rifle/carbine, compromised ballistics and a nearly comical appearance, and I havent done executive protection work in quite some time. Wilson Combat SFX9 5-Inch Solid Frame 9mm Pistol: First Look. Caliber + 300 BLK; 5.56 NATO; 7.62x39 . In the same breath, the gun is compact enough to enhance its nimbleness, yet big enough to ensure the cartridges ballistic integrity. Putting it into action required lifting it from its horizontal position. You have entered an incorrect email address! We set up a three-target array with just 10 feet between each target. Sig 716i or Springfield Victor Saint .308, https://www.surplusammo.com/categori-308-mags.html, MISC Training Course Announcements & AAR's, Former Vickers Shooting Method Regional Instructors, Pacific Northwest Training and Networking, All Other Longgun Parts, Accessories, & Magazines (EE), Handgun Parts, Accessories & Magazines (EE), If this is your first visit, be sure to While the plastic handguard and the buttstock showed a little bit of play, fit and function of the more important parts of the M400 Classic were exceptional. 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We tested our 1:7/1:8-twist-barreled carbines with 60-grain V-Max 223 Remington rounds plus 5.56mm ammunition topped with 69-grain OTM (open-tipped match), 77-grain OTM, and 77-grain TMK (tipped Match King) rounds from Black Hills Ammunition. I have a sig elite which is similar to the tread, no issues solid rifle. If you need a discreet weapon for 100-yard engagements, it's perfect. It's an entry level rifle that's pretty much designed to sell accessories. Detent at the safety was heavy and secure without any rough edges. This test was performed cold, one and done with no makeups. For our distance work we mounted a SIG Sauer 3-12x42mm Tango4 optical scope ($900 MSRP). 2023 Outdoor Sportsman Group. Between the friendly trigger, which our shooter was able to stage as we moved from target to target, and some adrenalin, we had added one full circuit, even if all 15 shots werent perfect. The SCAR 15P is chambered for 5.56 NATO and, with its 7.5-inch barrel, is the most compact SCAR to date. A Magpul dual split aperture flip-up rear sight was attached to the top rail that ran the length of the receiver. The abbreviated configurations of Americas favorite firearm are practically perfect in every way. I run the SIG SRD762TI on my Rattler. These guns eventually faded awaypartially because of their ammunition and because it was easier to use a variant of the M4 Carbinebut the need did not. The Sig Virtus has these possible configurations: 300 Blackout: Barrel Lengths 6.75", 9", and 16" 5.56mm : Barrel Lengths 11.5" and 16" The Virtus is the more flexible platform, but there is nothing wrong with the Rattler. Please keep us posted. Hence there are solid copper bullets for high speed applications in 16 inch carbines (1/6 rate or greater) that shoot 300 BLK, but the ammo is expensive. The civilian version of the U.S. Army's new XM7 rifle. Visually, this made them less obvious. Honey badger .300bo 5. Another design goal was optimized sound suppressor use, so sub- and supersonic 300 Blackout loads were developed. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Thanks to the precise trigger, the shooter always felt he was in complete control. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. The 3rd pic is the new Snakebite M400 5.56 Rifle , But It's a stock photo . MSRP: $700; palmettostatearmory.com, Good advice on the 300 blk pistols Anybody not owning a 300 blk should consider getting one Im 66 years young, big fan of 270,300 magnum but this 300 blk up to 150 yards is great . Get the latest news and reviews from Gundigest.com. You got the CZ shadow 2 orange is it 9mm or 40 cal. Fitting right into this slot is the Saint Victor 300 Blackout Pistol. Type: Semi-Auto Pistol. Hampering this a bit out of the box is a mil-spec clone trigger, easily rectified with your favorite upgrade model. When not at his press or the range he can be found chasing mule deer around the Rocky Mountains. Sig Sauer. Keeping all the shots inside the A-zone was important, but for our purposes we wanted to know what characteristics were helping or hindering the shooter. The Judge has been promoted! Dependent on load, firearm and environment, expect anywhere from a 250 fps to 350 fps difference between the lengths. Following the success of its initial collaboration with Vertx, Premier Body Armor announces its continued partnership. Concerning these small-but-potent arms, they're pretty dang slick in 5.56 NATO, but sing when chambered 300 Blackout. Somy wife and i was having lunch with the Sig rep. and I asked about the .308 maybe coming out in the tread And he said soon which it did . In late 2019, Springfield released the SAINT Pistol, featuring upgraded components and a retail price of just $849. One last more subtle upgrade was the trigger guard from Bravo Company that left more room for a gloved finger without necessarily having to unlatch the bottom panel. In use, it seemed to all but disappear. I took the Saint victor home and that's all it wrote for me . Wow just read the article on TTAG. Knowing this, I still was dubious when I picked up the PDW from my local FFL. The rear-sight assembly (sometimes referred to as BUIS or backup iron sight) was a flip-up design. The recoil was manageable with the hottest loads, and it was a pleasure to shoot with subsonics. Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. As for Springfields PDW, it is an AR, so it has familiar controls. Indoors, every load produced visible flash, but premium ammo gave me a small, manageable flash. My wife said I'm going to buy me a new gun which one do you think the Blue or Orange . An example that comes to mind is how the handguard that comes stock has mlok that only goes halfway down, and people complain about it getting real hot, and conveniently they sell a upgraded version with mlok that covers the whole thing, and effectively solves . While many people often think of AR pistols as just short-barreled carbines, in this case, the pistol appellation is quite apt. You have entered an incorrect email address! Before we get there, lets look at the concept of the personal-defense weapon (PDW). Springfield Armory of Illinois has been producing its own versions of the iconic M1A rifle for many years, but Springfield, like several other manufacturers, is known primarily as makers of handguns, or for that matter bolt-action rifles. This gun was designed from the ground up to be as discrete as possible while retaining all the capabilities of the MCX. There was, however, a relief on each side of the handguard about 2.5 inches ahead of the receiver for attaching a quick detach (QD) button-style sling loop. The fit between the top and bottom end of the CMMG Mk4T was admirably tight, yet the takedown pin was easy to operate. The Rattler has a one in five twist rate. Their latest addition is the Saint Edge PDW AR pistol, and Im sure it will get its large slice of the AR pie. I have builds from BCM, Springfield, Noveske and PSA. Sure, but thats not its sweet spot. With the brace collapsed, it is just 18.75 inches long. I said you really loved shooting the orange . Both companies have reputations for occasional issues with their QC, but Sig certainly produces a higher tier product overall. SPRINGFIELD ARMORY - SAINT 16" 5.56 BRAVO CO MLOK HANDGUARD, Sig Sauer M400 Tread .223/5.56 Semi-Automatic 30rd 16". I usually have to take break between mags. Rattler was built to be fired primarily unsuppressed, with the ability to be suppressed, if needed. Has anyone actually tried the omega 9k on the rattler? Eight major concealed carry insurance programs are now available to the millions of Americans who carry concealed. Substantial in some circumstances. AC63A5C8-2987-40EB-B654-CFB78764D21B_1530751250330.jpeg. The 2nd pic is from the Sig website.. SIG Sauer has just introduced their latest offering in their tread series of rifles with the introduction of the SIG TREAD Snakebite SE. The SIG Rattler is something special. SIG's Rattler pistols come with a 5.5 inch PDW threaded barrel and removable tool-less M-Lok Handguard. Essentially it boils down to performance and suppressibility. Keep Reading. With the stock folded, the gun is only 16 inches long, making it the shortest 300 Blackout weapon on the market. Apr 24, 2017 On a full-size rifle or carbine, I think the relieved magazine well of the Saint Edge looks a bit small, but on this build it looks just right. The Black Hills 77-grain OTM was best, producing 0.8-inch-wide groups, and the SIG Sauer 77-grain OTM ammunition produced an average five-shot group measuring 0.9 inch across. Building on the popularity of the company's Rattler in 300 BLK, SIG Sauer introduced a new model chambered in 5.56 NATO for 2019. . One answer would be to take advantage of the latest technology in terms of manufacturing, helpful features and improved ammunition. Most familiar with ARs know you dont have to go out and buy one specially chambered for the want-to-be 7.6239mm clone. The full-profile barrel creates a line that grows from a polymer handguard by Bravo Company that was flat on the sides, adorned with sections of pebbled finish for grip. This website contains many older reviews. (Tie) LWRC Smg-45 ($3k?fuck!) The Eberlestock bag worked well with the gun sporting a suppressor and fully loaded, and removing the can and ammunition would allow the Rattler to slide into a small laptop case. Unless otherwise noted, these reviews carry the guns prices at the time of the original review. Taurus Marketing Manager Caleb Giddings highlights the features of the new Taurus Raging Hunter 460 Magnum, a purpose-built revolver with a 10.5-inch barrel and an effective recoil-taming brake, with Guns & Ammo Executive Editor Joe Kurtenbach. The SIG MCX Rattler is an incredibly handy rifle that's easy to conceal. But upon closer inspection, we noticed that the safety and magazine release were ambidextrous. Interestingly, Sig is one of the gunmakers that subscribe to faster-than-usual twist rates for 300 Blackout1:5. But I also own several Springfields (M1As in 308 & 6.5cm, Saint Ar15 when it first came out, compact XDe, XDs & XD Mod2 all in 45s, TRPs in 45 & 10mm and the now discontinued Range Officer in 45). The barrel is 16 inches and features a 1:8 twist. Our Team Said: When it comes to paying more for a rifle, or any firearm for that matter, its easy to check off a list of features to justify a higher price tag. Its very handy. Garmin Tactix 7 Pro Ballistic Solar-Powered GPS Smartwatch: First Look, How to Choose the Best Scope Reticle for Your Application, Colt King Cobra Target 22LR Rimfire Revolver: New for 2022, Self-Defense Handgun and Ammo Options for People With Dexterity and Strength Issues, 5 Best Red-Dot Optics for SIG Sauer P365X & XL Pistols. The target to our right showed three A-zone hits and a stray shot in the D-zone, furthest from center. The stripped-down SBR version of the Rattler weighs in at 5.7 pounds. Not only did the 77-grainers shoot straight, this uber-short-barreled pistol grouped between 2.5 and 4 MOA with everything I gave it. 9mm this thing is a work of art and insanely smooth as silk , it shoots its self ..LOL. Maybe they will give me some clarity. SIG P320 TACOPS vs Springfield XDM Elite 4.5 Tactical 19,446 views Mar 13, 2020 370 Dislike Share Save Hammer Striker 79.8K subscribers In this video we compare two tactical offerings: The new. Will it perform at greater distances? Perfectly tailored to man the ramparts of your home. Hay Talyn, The 1st pic is of the new Switchblade 5.56 Pistol , Which is a real pic from the LGS. I think I've driven myself mad with comparing the pros and cons. The companys thinking must be a suppressor is going on there anyway, so cut costs with the standard muzzle device. For more information, please see our Actually, there is little here that would put off the sophisticated shooter as well. (Notice they fixed this on the new Edge pistol with a longer barrel.) 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