Pilots I know firsthand, who had massive training and proficiency issues, are now working for major carrierssome in heavy jets, others in the NB left seat. There are pilots making it into airline cockpits that have had training failures at other airlines and they have been able to hide them from future employers. This incident at the airport in Presque Isle was very disturbing and frightening for the passengers and crew who were involved, said Senator Collins. At an Appropriations hearing in July 2019, The report determined the probable causes of this accident to be, The first officers fatigue, which exacerbated his confirmation bias, and. [1][2], The aircraft was a 14-year-old Embraer EMB-145XR first delivered to ExpressJet in October 2004, for Continental Express. This information is not presented as the Flight Safety Foundation or the Aviation Safety Networks opinion as to the cause of the accident. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. One pilot & three passenger reported minor injuries. Hello world! Contributing to the accident was also the first officers fatigue, which exacerbated his confirmation bias and the failure of at least six pilots who had observed the localizer misalignment to report it to the company and air traffic before the accident. Part of the landing gear was torn away, and the nose cone was damaged. I had no idea that snow could affect the localizer signal. Nonetheless, they didnt call for a second go-around. Following the incident, Senator Collins contacted the National Transportation Safety Board and asked them to investigate the cause of the accident. DropTank Well-Known Member May 22, 2022 #3 Roger Roger said: This community is for discussion among pilots, students, instructors and aviation After the go-around, the first officer asked the captain if she saw the runway lights during the approach. Its like we didnt learn from Colgan, except to keep the 1500 hr (which I dont think would have stopped the crash, but different topic for different day). United Express flight 4933, operated by CommutAir, was attempting to land on runway 1 at Presque Isle International Airport (PQI), Maine, USA, and impacted terrain to the right of the runway. (closed by non-admin page mover) Extraordinary Writ (talk) 20:49, 15 August 2022 (UTC), CommutAir Flight 4933 United Express Flight 4933 Per WP:COMMONNAME, crashes of regional jets operated by contractors under a major airline's regional brand name should use the brand name for easy identification by members of the general public, who are typically unfamiliar with contractors such as CommutAir (not to mention Envoy, Endeavor, Republic, Jazz Aviation, etc.). Privacy Policy. I have started a talk page discussion about possibly revising the naming conventions to clearly address regional-brand flights. Cassie Daigle took this photo inside the plane shortly after it stopped. The accident closed the airport Monday, and it is not known immediately when outgoing and incoming flights will resume, she said. The pilot did not touch down on the first attempt. There were three minor injuries. See this is my problem with the industry. I bet the Captain's story is, its the planes fault, or the airports fault? Carguychris (talk) 19:14, 21 July 2022 (UTC), The result of the move request was: no consensus. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Commutair 4933 Roger Roger May 22, 2022 1 2 3 4 Next Roger Roger Paid to sleep, fly for fun May 22, 2022 #1 Couldn't find the original threads, but the docket is open NTSB Docket - Docket Management System data.ntsb.gov Minuteman "Dongola" May 22, 2022 #2 Oh yeah . Daigle said his wife hit her head during the incident and once the couple returns to Fort Kent she plans to be evaluated at Northern Maine Medical Center as a precaution. So if they can get through training, off to the line they go. Wednesday, March 6, 2019 at 8:04:00AM EST, Wednesday, March 6, 2019 at 9:15:00AM EST, Sunday, February 6, 2022 at 9:15:00PM EST, Sunday, February 6, 2022 at 9:30:00PM EST, Monday, March 11, 2019 at 12:37:00AM EDT, Saturday, March 23, 2019 at 8:50:00PM EDT, Wednesday, January 8, 2020 at 6:49:00PM EST, Sunday, February 6, 2022 at 9:20:00PM EST, Wednesday, July 13, 2022 at 12:20:00AM EDT. On March 4, 2019, CommutAir flight 4933, operating the service for United Airlines onboard an Embraer EMB145XR, registration N14171, was attempting to land on runway 1 at Presque Isle International Airport (PQI) when it impacted terrain to the right of the runway. It is preliminary and is based on the facts as they are known at this time. Commutair. Fleet type match . Airport maintenance staff later reported that the runway lights were not illuminated at the time. Crew missed first approach bc something didnt look right when they went visual, then apparently just sorta yolod it on the second attempt and had some severe confirmation bias when looking at what they thought were the runway/lights. Ive seen interview flights of no more than 20 minutes lead to absolutely invaluable insight. Flight Conducted Under: Part 121: Air Carrier - Scheduled. Archived post. The NTSB report uses CommutAir in favor of United Express and through that, I note that nearly every article is mentioned through that convention (excluding Colgan Air Flight 3407 and a lengthy discussion about it took place if you see the archives. The pilot did not touch down on the first attempt. commutair 4933 ntsb report. The aircraft that arrived around 11:30 a.m. Monday also sustained unspecified damage and is remaining in place until investigators with the Federal Aviation Administration can assess the incident, Smith said. Senator Susan Collins, the Ranking Member of the Transportation Appropriations Subcommittee, issued a statement on the release of the National Transportation Safety Boards (NTSB) final report on the missed runway incident at Presque Isle International Airport that occurred in March of 2019. A preliminary report Thursday [March 21] indicates the 50-seat Embraer 145 approached to the right of the runway on an aborted first landing attempt and then again when it touched down March . As I said, drama might as well have been her middle name. He had accumulated a total of 4,909 flight hours, 470 on the Embraer EMB-145XR. A month later we got a PRIA request from another operator. Photos showed some of the landing gear stuck in one of the engines. Many were hired right after failures. The pilot flying was a man. Since Atlas 3591 and Colgan 3407 airlines are scrutinizing training failures a little closer. Safety Recommendation Report . Airborne 03.03.23: Lear 23 Restoration, DarkAero Update, KBOS 'Close Call', Airborne-Flight Training 03.02.23: SAFE Alarmed, Clay Lacy Scholars, EAA LTF Efforts, Airborne 03.01.23: B-29 Doc Returns!, SAFE Sounds Alarm, PC-12 Breakup, 2007 - 2023 Web Development & Design by Pauli Systems, LC, NTSB: United Express E145 Missed Runway Entirely. Subscribe . Can anyone confirm the following?There was no runway involved in the accident Never landed on the runway.Captain had been fired from another airline.Captain was "difficult" (I'm trying to be nice here) to fly with. Photo: NTSB. Simple Flying will be at the Farnborough Airshow next week. PRIA is worthless when airlines just let it slide with a good Cage Consulting spit shine. At 11:16EST, the pilots contacted airport staff[N 1] to verify that the runway lights were turned on at maximum brightness; the staff turned on the lights at the brightest setting. She nearly received a crew room beat down from one of my favorite ( but also very hot blooded) flight attendants. United Express, landed between runway 1 and taxiway A in light to moderate snow at Northern Maine Regional Airport at Presque Isle (KPQI), Presque Isle, Maine. Did anyone else see that they got the shaker during the first missed, and set off the EGPWS? They dont need to know the aircraft or the area or the SOP. But of course, you can also have all news mailed right onto your desktop, too. The non-flying pilot was a female captain with a history of training failures. As a leader of the Transportation Appropriations Subcommittee, Senator Collins has consistently secured robust funding for the instrument landing system (ILS) that provides pilots with precision landing information in poor visibility. Both pilots had missed entirely the runway, which was covered in about inch of snow, and only about 20% to 25% of it was visible. I did a bit of work in the training department at my regional. Accident Reports are one of the main products of an NTSB investigation. Why has literally no information been put out by the NTSB? [1]:4 Airport maintenance staff did not have the means to measure localizer alignment directly. Couldnt find the original threads, but the docket is open. Contrary to early reports, they missed the runway entirely. She failed her EMB-145 checkride during her initial attempt and was later placed under "increased scrutiny" by CommutAir twice. CA had a checkered (failure) history. Cass did say to me she will be OK when she sees Keegan, Rick Daigle said. 3:11-cv-05 | Casetext Search + Citator. The first officer then spotted a tower near the aircraft's position, and realizing that the aircraft was not aligned properly with the runway, he initiated a missed approach. Left Virgin for "Paper work issues", never heard that reason before. 2008-2023 by The Aviation Herald, all rights reserved, reprint and republishing prohibited. Would not be surprised to see this Captain's name associated with another incident/accident. Nobody gets a pass for sex and skin color. These are the issues PRD is trying to solve. If you search the database for accidents in Presque Isle, Maine there is no mention of flight 4933. CommutAir/United Express #UA4933 from Newark landed in Presque Isle and left the runway to the right. The NTSB announced two investigators have been dispatched to Presque Isle to investigate the accident of the United Express Embraer ERJ-145XR. The line is connecting ADS-B datapoints from FlightAware. I would prefer to add accidents in circumstances similar to this one: botched instrument approaches resulting in the aircraft touching down somewhere other than the intended landing runway. . The National Transportation Safety Board traveled to the scene of this accident. The aircraft was piloted by a 40-year-old captain who joined CommutAir in March 2013 before working for another air carrier in November 2015. [3], The aircraft had three crew members (two pilots and a flight attendant). By subscribing to our service you can get the news mailed right onto your desktop as soon as The Aviation Herald reports them and get permission to publish the news/articles on your website or reprint them in your newspaper (but not to relicense/redistribute them to other venues), provided you print proper reference (avherald) or provide a proper link to our article on your online publication. At least they were at the correct airport. They have no business being in these cockpits. For information on a specific accident or incident, direct your inquiries to the National Transportation Safety Board at the following address: 490 L'Enfant Plaza East, SW. Rick and Cassie Daigle, owners of Too Far North Fitness in Fort Kent, were on this United flight that ended up off the runway at the airport in Presque Isle on Monday morning. The Daigles were still at the airport as of 2 p.m. after having been interviewed by emergency medical technicians and a United representative, Daigle said. Although she had subsequently received her EMB-145 type rating and been upgraded to captain, the NTSB said that "her repeated training problems indicated an inadequate foundation for being a captain, which CommutAir did not effectively address. I remember her from when I got hired at VX. The airplane was substantially damaged. The first officer and two of the 28 passengers sustained minor injuries. However, none of the pilots reported the issues. The Aviation Safety Network is an exclusive service provided by: United Express flight 4933, operated by CommutAir, was attempting to land on runway 1 at Presque Isle International Airport (PQI), Maine, USA, and impacted terrain to the right of the runway. How difficult he is ? Perhaps the craziest example of this was with King Air N13LY, which didn't record the accident flight but instead "During the flight to Fort Yukon, a radio broadcast from an ESPN radio affiliate was received and recorded on channel 1 of the CVR. Last Update: Saturday, Mar 4th 2023 20:54Z. The ILS was screwy bc of snow, known issue in PQI. [1]:5. Instrument meteorological conditions (IMC) prevailed at the airfield, with low ceilings, fog, and blowing snow. The airplane was substantially damaged. Even when it's non-functional, they still write a report on it. Daigle said the plane then bounced four or five times before coming to a stop at a location far from the runway. This isn't surprising to me at all. The failed landing was the second attempt to land. On Mar 5th 2019 the FAA reported: "Commutair Flight 4933 Embraer E45X landed in the grass area beside the runway due to unknown circumstances." The occurrence was rated an accident. Same man, was checking about everyday for the last month or so. ago I did a bit of work in the training department at my regional. Flight status, tracking, and historical data for CommutAir 4933 (C54933/UCA4933) 17-Mar-2022 (KIAH-KLFT) including scheduled, estimated, and actual departure and arrival times. Light to moderate snow was reported by the NTSB. Now Im working with them at a majorand guess what? At an Appropriations hearing in July 2019, Senator Collins raised this issue directly with then-Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao. The plane literally is nowhere near the actual runway, he said, adding that snowplows had to remove snow so that emergency responders could get to the plane to help the injured passengers. That final report has been out for months. This community is for discussion among pilots, students, instructors and aviation professionals. At 11:28EST, as the aircraft descended through 200ft (61m) AGL, the minimum decision height for the approach, the captain called out "runway in sight twelve o'clock." NTSB said it will document the reconstruction using 3D techniques, and the data will be archived for historical purposes. I have to wonder if I could have been honest, if that copilot and passenger would be alive today. During a postaccident interview, the first officer stated that, when he transitioned from flight instruments to the outside during the second approach, he again saw white on white and blowing snow. I understand that there could be some malicious company managers that could abuse this, but there has to be a way to tell hiring managers that a pilot is a danger. If you have to use the proxy of your company, contact us. Rick Daigle said the scene inside the airplane as it landed was one of chaos with people screaming and seat parts popping off. On March 4, 2019, CommutAir flight 4933, operating the service for United Airlines onboard an Embraer EMB145XR, registration N14171, was attempting to land on runway 1 at Presque Isle International Airport (PQI) when it impacted terrain to the right of the runway. March 17, 2020. We determine the probable cause of the accidents we investigate and issue . But could have also been Line Oriented Flight Training. The carrier that won the hunger games contract wars of 2020. Senator Susan Collins, the Ranking Member of the Transportation Appropriations Subcommittee, issued a statement on the release of the National Transportation Safety Boards (NTSB) final report on the missed runway incident at Presque Isle International Airport that occurred in March of 2019. Oh well, its not like lives are at stake or anything. Not sure if this Captain is one of them, but she sure does seem to have had quite a few more failures then I would be comfortable flying with. The EMB145XR subsequently impacted the snow-covered grassy area between runway 1 and a parallel taxiway. Frankly, it's a white man's favorite myth. The aircraft appears intact enough to preserve the FDR and CVR. [5] Five people[5] were taken to the hospital including the first officer and two passengers who received minor injuries from the accident. Washington, D.C. Today, U.S. During the ensuing approach, both pilots said they saw the runway, albeit with difficulty due to snow. I had an employee that was a good stick and rudder pilot but horrible decision maker, cocky, and just did stupid shit like rolling a company 207. I'm personally still waiting to see what happened to the American that struck ground and a few others at JFK. Remove the mounting nuts and the mounting bolts. The accident was attributed to confirmation bias which prompted the flight crew to continue descending even though they could not see the runway due to snow; poor decision-making by the captain, fatigue of the first officer, and problems with the airport's instrument landing system were identified as contributing factors. A United Express Embraer EMB-145XR similar to the one involved in the accident. We give them kids stuff. The Ohio-based regional carrier, in which No.3 U.S. airline . The flight was operated by CommutAir under the United Express brand. The airplane was substantially damaged. If you search the database for accidents in Presque Isle, Maine there is no mention of flight 4933. On the second attempt, the pilot landed off the runway between runway 1 and a parallel taxiway. I am so curious to know why it took so long for really anything to be released about this accident. And before anyone starts screaming discrimination and racism, go F off, I know pilots of every sex, color and creed that are outstanding aviators, AND I know white pilots that I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw them! Fired from what airline ? Reports provide details about the accident, analysis of the factual data, conclusions and the probable cause of the accident, and the related safety recommendations. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. The airplane touched down before he could determine what he was seeing. FAA guidance before the accident did not specifically address snow depth around a localizer antenna; after the accident, the guidance was revised to state that localizer alignment should be checked if snow accumulated to a depth exceeding 2ft (0.61m)[1]:4, The NTSB found that at least six CommutAir pilots had noticed the localizer misalignment within the preceding five days before the accident but none had filed a company aviation safety action program (ASAP) report; however, four of them filed ASAP reports after the accident. Wow, clearly that investigator was a sport's guy, cause I wouldn't have known what to make of it. Moreover, prior to the second landing, the pilots discontinued the ILS approach after they had misidentified the runway. The aircraft touched down at 11:29EST and came to rest in a snow-covered grassy area between the runway and a parallel taxiway. There are probably so many qualified candidates out there that would be a joy to fly with but didnt get the job because they used the wrong greeting. [7], The NTSB identified the first officer's lack of sleep as a contributing factor. The fact that the product that airlines seek can be bought and behavior tailored shows just how fucked some hiring practices are. And for such a serious incident too, anything involving airlines usually takes 2 years. Airborne 02.24.23: GAMA 2022 Report, Piper News, Starship March Launch. Strange incident with few details to this day. She has a 777 type now so she doesnt work for commutair. The first officer was the pilot flying and the captain was the pilot monitoring. The Daigles are parents to a 4 1 /2 year old son. Accident Number: ENG15IA024 Operator/Flight Number: United Express flight 4776 (operated by CommutAir) Aircraft and Registration: Bombardier DHC-8-202, N363PH . PRESQUE ISLE, Maine (WAGM) - The National Transportation Safety Board issued a final report on the missed runway incident at the Presque Isle International Airport that happened in 2019. After reaching the decision altitude, the captain said she had seen the runway in front of the aircraft. There were 28 passengers and three crew members on board CommutAir flight 4933 flying from Newark to Presque Isle, the company said. The flight was operating under the provisions of Title 14 Code of Federal Regulations Part 121 as a regularly scheduled domestic passenger from Newark International Airport (KEWR), Newark, New Jersey, to KPQI. He had not gone to sleep until around 1:00 EST the night before the accident due to flight and shuttle delays during the preceding workday, and he had only slept until 6:00 EST, about five hours, whereas he usually slept for about eight hours. The pilots attempted to land again in a second attempt. The preliminary report on the accident of United Flight 4933 says that on March 4th at 11:43 am United Express landed between runway 1 and the taxiway in light to moderate snow at the Northern Maine Regional Airport in Presque Isle. Categories . [1]:15, In a post crash interview, the first officer of the flight stated that when he transitioned from looking at his flight instruments to the outside, all he could see was "white on white". Do you think the history of the CA here will have any impact on contributing factors to future hiring practices? On Mar 5th 2019 the FAA reported: "Commutair Flight 4933 Embraer E45X landed in the grass area beside the runway due to unknown circumstances." The occurrence was rated an accident. The flying pilot should have executed to go around yet did not. The benefits of subscriptionGet the news right onto your desktop when they happenPut the news on your website/in your newspaper. They found that on the initial approach the crew executed a go-around as they weren't able to establish the runway, they saw snow and a structure with an antenna but no runway. 2017. The failure of CommutAir pilots who had observed an issue with the ILS prior to the accident and failed to report it to the company and air traffic control. I was suppose to start a four day trip with an individual that displayed this described behavior. Unfortunately, it was implemented way too late to catch things like Atlas and this, but thats the nature of the beast: reactive and years behind at best. The plane will remain in place until the FAA arrives to assess the situation.

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