We'll walk you through the process and offer some simple tips and trick. And here is why. I think that makes a difference. Say you start with a classic blade 7 iron with 40* static loft by how much could you reduce the loft in conjunction with a GI head design without launching the ball lower? Fairway Metal- Taylormade SLDR Mini Driver 12* w/ Fujikura Rombax TP95-X", Utility- Mizuno MPH5 1 iron w/ Aldila RIP 85X (depending on course/ conditions), Irons- Mizuno MP- FLI HI 2i w/ Aldila Proto ByYou 100X Currently I play a set of old-school Ping Eye 2s, which I love, but I want the benefits of modern irons and forged heads. Would they still be ideal? **. Compare that with 49-year-old Atwal, with a best of 49th place since 2021 and an average first-round placing of around 120th for his three starts in 2023, and Scott Brown, admittedly a former winner here, but now 719th in the world and who has, since September, withdrawn twice during tournaments, and missed his last two cuts (Pebble and Honda) ranking 99th and 136th for his first round he certainly looks wrong in every way. It is common for the golfers I fit to hit todays irons, which average about 2 degrees less loft per club, as high as their current set (if not higher). Ping Glide wedges w/Recoil 110 Newer irons, however, are designed with a loft angle that is between 18 and 22 degrees. In the five starts mentioned above, the St. Simons resident has some impressive first round finishes. I tried it today but I can still hit my 6i farther than my 64 degree lw. Free shipping for many products! Even if you want to say a weakened 4 iron is longer in length than a 5 iron of the same loft and therefore goes farther, your gaps in your set will still be equally proportionate. Any knowledge on the subject would be appreciated. More than likely you will hit the ball a bit farther as well, potentially close to 1/2 a club. A good tune-up is a good tune-up regardless of the final loft gaps. (others have mentioned) I went to GG with my pops and hit the speedblade 9i for sheets and was hitting them 165-170why? Like you said, it will change the bounce but other than that, it wont change much and shouldnt effect the playability of the club unless you are really steep and need the bounce. Chamblee takes on Tiger: Brandel, meet Bayless, Tweets of the week: Lizards, grammar police, bad greens, worse sunglasses. Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Here are common ball flight issues if you are playing the wrong lie angle: Unfortunately, club manufacturing companies sometimes use different lie angles for their clubs. At a club fitting it was pointed out that I had about a 0 aoa and was launching a bit higher than ideal. Clubs are mass-produced with certain manufacturing variances in every factory. I take healthy beaver pelts with short irons, but the 2 iron is just a nip of grass. It just depends. Arnold Palmer Invitational 2023 (*** NO LIV DISCUSSIONS/REFERENCES ***), Custom Ping i230 5-UW KBS Tour R+ Power Spec, G425 3 wood with GD TP, Ping Kaili Shaft,King Tec Hybrid, Jaws Raw & Zipcore Wedge, Airmax 97, Apex UW. I know some pros naturally hit it higher, and some lower. Strengthening the loft should decrease the effective offset shouldn't it? Your 4i and 5i will tend to get more rollout than the higher # irons, hence the 3* loft gaps. The 2-degree limit is only recommended when changing the lofts on irons due to the potential effect such bends will have on the sole angle of the club. Because of my forward foot was so much above my trail foot, my hands were a good 6" behind the ball, when compared to a level lie. 5-G They catch a bit but I hit it crispier. That means someone who has a ballflight thats too low, he delivers the head with less loft than needed, and by that less than the design of the head is meant to be played with, so he cant go wrong by tweaking lofts weaker. I haven't built them yet, i was wondering if the results are still working out a year or so later? Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Titleist AP3 3 iron 2 degrees strong AMT black stiff shaft at the best online prices at eBay! And visa versa, if the original bounce is low and/or the club has a sharp leading edge, the reduction in bounce may have a significant impact on playability. I can't say that they have kicked my 716 ap2 out for good, but for now the 716 cb are staying in the bag! But Im not sure whats being accomplished with weakening irons. You cannot paste images directly. Taylormade SIM UDI 2i / Diamana THUMP 100X, Taylormade P770 3i (bent weak) / Project X LS 6.5, Taylormade P7MC 5-7i, P7MB 8-9i / Project X LS 6.5. You cannot paste images directly. I am 2 handicap, playing Scottish Links golf, smooth tempo, 80-90mph, pretty straight flight, shallow divot. Definitely worth getting L/L check done and adjusted where necessary. All very well getting consistent loft gaps if your distance gaps are varied. If you're after a driving iron, I would expect you to use it off the tee for the most part. More is not always better, but I would expect nothing less from a fitter at Carls Golfland. Yes, the T200 can be bent 2 degrees flat and beyond 2 degrees upright Titleist manufactures heads 2 degrees upright which can be bent up to a further 2 degrees i.e up to 4 degrees from standard Please sign in to comment TUser January 21, 2020 at 08:09 AM Along the same lines, I got my new T200 irons late last year. Titleist Response to USGA / R&A Distance Insights. So I hit my standard 50 yard pitch with a 54* wedge. In a typical golf set, loft increases as shaft length decreases. That said, no equipment can make up for poor fundamentals in your approach to moving a golf ball around three to four miles of real estate in the least number of strokes. The so-called "standard" lie angles are 9 iron at 64* with a spacing of 1 deg between clubs. It, In any case one can't really compare clubs anymore with respect to asking what someone hit. Brent Grantcould very well be one of the seasons fairy stories by September, having already secured his 2022/23 card with a stunning 50-foot birdie putt on the last hole of the Korn Ferry Tour Championship enough to finish 11th and sneak in. Generally though as you decrease theloft of a club by one degree, you reduce its bounce a degree at the same time and if you increase the loft by one degree you increase the bounce by a degree. And visa versa, if the original bounce is low and/or the club has a sharp leading edge, the reduction in bounce may have a significant impact on playability. And the opposite is true as the speed drops. OP, which is it you are asking about.. making a club 2* stronger or increasing loft? Mizuno MP59 4i-6I w/ PX 6.5, Wedges- Scratch 8620 Driver/Slider set. Don't think you'd notice a difference of 2. Your golf ball starts off towards the left of your target (right for lefties). Here is a quick list of scenarios that might mean that you need to use a flatter lie angle in your clubs: On the flip side, here is a list of situations that might require you to get a more upright lie angle: The best way to get your loft and lie adjusted is by a professional club fitter. The 27-year-old made his way onto the top level by virtue of his performance on the Korn Ferry Tour during the combined Covid seasons, and hes doing a great job in honing his craft. The bounce on the 3-iron is already 0 degrees, so will bending the club for a stronger loft make the bounce go negative? So I changed my swing to compress the ball better instead, and just took extra club and swing easy. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. After a quick gapping review we bent 2 clubs and tried those out which gave a good base to work from. Golfers should liken their iron fittings to that of a driver. St Louis, MO. VokeySM6 Raw- 50F, Scotty Cameron X5R Flow Neck Torched Finish. *Performance average removes all outliers good and bad, to give a distance based on how far a well struck shot will go. Guaranteed that if you looked at your ball speed it was dramatically higher. A golf club can be bent two degrees flat when the lie angle is lowered and the heel of the club is raised to a position that is higher than the toe of the club. These are topics that have been kicked around and that are important in todays market, so articles will most likely be touching on them in the future. 5 Testers Needed! Changing the lie angle of a club can help golfers more consistently hit shots off of the center of the clubface. The risk that the club will break at the hosel is too high. It is very easy to do these modifications, and also recommended by a lot of folks to have your set checked either frequently or at the end of each year in case any changes happened during the season from general play. This puts a 5 iron at 60* and that is way too flat for most people. I know that for every degree strong I bend it, it will take a degree off the bounce. Would bending it serve the same result? I realize it is hard to write to such a diverse audience, but Im going to give it my best with this post, and pose the basic two questions to each of you : If the answer to No. You can be assured there is not a single successful player in the professional ranks who does not have a fundamentally sound grip on the club. With your height you obviously need to be fit properly. Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Taylor Made Stealth 10.5 Aldila Ascent Red R flex, Wilson D7 forged 5-GW- Mamiya recoil 460 R flex, Titleist Pro VIxoptic yellow with revkev stamped on them. While golf club manufacturers certainly try to make a consistent product, there are often inconsistencies in the lofts and lies of the clubs and they may not be progressively consistent from one club to another. Reset Password The decision wasn't about distance it was about gapping. All rights reserved. Then if your wedge gaps are off you might tweak them a degree. I am now thinking I am just going to bend my 712 Ap2 irons to the 714 AP2 specs so my gaps will match up better with my wedges. This happens probably most frequently with wedges, when a person wants to play 3 instead of 4 wedges for example. :-). If the customer cant get the 4 iron in the air, pull that too and give them a hybrid that will get in the air. You hit the golf ball off of the heel of the club often causing the golf ball to hook or pull, You are playing clubs too short for you (again. I have been reading that the more offset you add it will end up more of a hook shot. My advice would be to start by making sure the lofts are set to manufacturers specs. My advice is to get fit as cheaply as you can and find some newer distance irons on Ebay or BST that can fit you. What does the average golfer look like? Well break down what the average golfer (male golfer) looks like and offers data that can be used to benchmark your game against. Not a dispute with the OP, maybe even validation, but what about head style? Brilliant information ! Club fitters are able to bend clubs to increase or decrease the lie angle using a loft, lie bending machine. Novak has finished 11th after the first round in Hawaii, fifth at Torrey Pines and in the top-30 at Pebble Beach and at the Honda. Where Can You Get Your Lie Angle Adjusted, Should You Use Heavier Shafts in Wedges? Weakening lofts makes zero sense to me. TaylorMade Aero Burner TP 15 / Matrix White Tie 70-X It would increase if you added loft. Step 1 for those golfers is to increase ball speed. Clear editor. Generally bending lofts on irons unless you are tweaking them to even out a gap. well unfortunately people buy clubs based on their ego and the club manufactures feed it. Tour Preferred X or TP5x ball. The main reason it is done on GolfWRX is so people can brag how far they hit their irons, generally with a passive brag. TaylorMade M1 15* Tensei CK Pro White 80X or Titleist 620 MB 5-9 Oban CT 125 Hybrid: Cobra King Tec 2h, MMT 80 S -or- TEE CBX 17*, HZRDUS 85 6.0, 2 iron: Mizuno MP-20 HMB, Steelfiber i95 S, 39.5", Irons grab bag: 1-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S; 1-PW Golden Ram TW282, RIP Tour 115 R; 3-AW Pinhawk Vertex irons, Apollo std stepped S Its taking up to 2 degrees off each iron. Just curious but, can I bend a set of titleist cb718 to the titleist ap2 718 specs? Bending 2* strong will increase the clubs digging tendencies. So the assumption is that the loft alone is what is creating more distance with the new irons. Ping G400 Max driver w/Aldila Rogue 125 Silver This will change the trajectory of the ball, and can potentially cause misdirected shots. Among full-swing clubs, drivers have the lowest degrees of loft (some pros use drivers with as little as 7 degrees of loft; most recreational golfers use drivers lofted at 9 to 14 degrees). Add in the added forgiveness of modern irons, and you have a winning combination. Bending the hosel toward or away from the face plane, opens or closes the clubs face angle. Golfers change the lie angle of a club to better their chances of hitting the center of the clubface. Driver: G425 LST 9on Fujikura VENTUSBlue 5S, Fairway: G425LST 3w on Fujikura VENTUSBlue 6S, G425MAX 9won Graphite Design Tour ADDI7S, Utility: KING Forged Utility Black 4 on UST RECOIL SMACWRAP, Irons: KING Forged TEC Black5-Gon Mitsubishi MMT, Wedges:ES2154& Hi Toe Raw58on KBS Hi Rev 2.0, Putter: Triple Track Double Wide White Hot, Balls: Pro V1TP5xChrome Soft Triple Track x LS. Nick is a Certified Performance Club Fitter at Carl's Golfland in Bloomfield Hills, Mich. But, as lofts are strengthened the gaps become compressed on the long end and widened on the short. I did this several years ago and it ended up being quite expensive, so dont be me and order your custom set all at once! Should I see any difference in 1 degree stronger irons? All data in this article is gathered from Shot Scopes database of over 140,000 golfers and in excess of 250 million shots recorded using performance tracking products such as the unique PRO LX+ laser rangefinder. Good luck! The golfwrx wannabe touring pros will argue otherwise.. After reading the headline I was expecting a slightly different subject discussed but this topic is something Ive been wondering about myself. Not sure about the AP2s. I'm guessing it will dig more but how much more? Titleist does recommend no more than +/- 2 degrees from factory and you should be ok. Any more and there is a risk of the stress cracks in the hosel area (primarily cosmetic). Since loft and bounce is connected, and cant be split no matter what we do. The new grooves should also be mentioned as allowing the ball to slide up the face a little more compared to the older grooves. Or, is the bounce all the same? As long as the spin rate is acceptable, the new irons, because of their lower center of gravity, are going to produce more speed off the face (due to the lower loft and lower COG) and more distance. The loft difference in the AP2 7 iron and AP3 6 iron is 6 degrees apart. Lower lofts will travel a bit farther and a bit lower, higher lofts will travel a bit less and fly a bit higher. The 4 iron will have a negative bounce if you bend them 2 degrees. GolfWRX_Official Step 3. Thanks! By 00bolt, May 18, 2017 in WRX Club Techs. Display as a link instead, Equipment counts courtesy of Darrell Survey. Upload or insert images from URL. You cannot paste images directly. Lots of good comments here. Odyssey #7 Tank, I got a set of Titleist 716 cb that are bent 2 degrees strong (they end up being 1 Degree weaker than my old z745 I believe). I am glad you mentioned shaft length, static lengths for GI clubs, how it impacts flight, etc. The difference after they were set to factory lofts and lie for my swing was amazing! 4-AW with juiced lofts is the same set as an old 3-PW that would probably be 22*-48*. Yes, it would make the clubs a little 'longer' (with a lower ball flight), but it might not be worth it, especially if you already take a divot. 716 MB'S. If this continues well end up with 25* 7 irons and carry 6 or 7 gap wedges. question on bending a forged iron 2 degrees strong By ssfranny, January 22, 2019 in WRX Club Techs Reply to this topic Start new topic ssfranny Lefty Boomers 3.5k Feedback 20 0 0 Total Rating 100% Posted January 22, 2019 Have a set of basically new MP 53s I want to bend them 2 degrees strong to make them play more a modern loft. would 2 degrees be too much and change the club's characteristics too much? SW: 56* Scratch Tour Dept(CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold SpinnerLW: 60* Scratch Tour Department (CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold SpinnerXW: 64* Cally XForged Vintage w/ DG X100 8 iron tiger steppedPutter: Nike Method Prototype 006 at 34"Have a ton of back-ups in all categories, but there are always 14 clubs in the bag that differ depending on the course and set-up. You won't notice it. Maybe manufacturers will take note (I doubt it, but keep trying. Usually weak, but occasionally strong, and if done intelligently where you don't hurt the clubs playability it's no big deal. If you think about it, a flatter lie would be toe down for your swing. Great article. Nick so, how much difference can CoG location make to the optimum loft? Fitters have to find some way to raise their ball flight, because those golfers lack the speed necessary to get the best results from many modern iron heads. Titleist does recommend no more than +/- 2 degrees from factory and you should be ok. Any more and there is a risk of the stress cracks in the hosel area (primarily cosmetic). What I was hoping from this article was proof for that a current 46* MB/CB PW doesnt go any further than the 47/48* PWs of the past. Great point I am a low ball hitter looking for more distance especially in my high irons. And the grip should be light enough to allow supple movement in the wrists during the swing. A wind-affected island track that offers rewards for aggression. The JPX-825 Pro's are all 1 degree stronger than the MP-H5's. So, I was thinking that I would have the new iron bent one degree strong so that it fits with the rest of my set. Offset degrees especially with a long iron can be a factor along with sole design. Yes, it would make the clubs a little 'longer' (with a lower ball flight), but it might not be worth . Thats basically what companies are doing anyway. From my observation of thousands of golfers of all skill levels, far too many are deficient in the fundamentals, starting with the grip, and then to the set-up and only then to the swing motion. LOWER COG IN NEW IRONS REQUIRES LESS LOFT A LOT OF THE TIME TO GET THE SAME DISTANCE OF OLDER CLUBS WITH A HIGHER COG. But what about the mid and low irons, yes I understand some companies make 6/7 hybrids (7 and up is very rare), but you can not really replace an 8 iron with a true hybrid. 5 Testers Needed! Hi all, I was wondering if bending a club 2* strong would affect the playability of said club? document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Why knowing the different variations in epoxy matter Here How to create excitement before they take the first What you can expect with a Mitchell Golf Angle Mitchell Golf Equipment Company Clamp the piece of angle iron into the vise. Clear editor. Everyone tries to boast yardage, not consistency and accuracy. How noticeable will the difference in trajectory be and will distances change? Forged irons should be checked every year or 2 anyway for loft/lie. Display as a link instead, Forged titanium models are bendable as well due to their softer titanium structure. I've never had a sand wedge bent. To do this, simply Google, Golf Club Fitters Near Me and you will get a great list of places that will make sure you are playing the right lie angle for your game. So if you have the time, watch this cool video that I really like explaining how important lie angle is for your golf game: Having and knowing the correct lie angle of your clubs will be a game changer, I promise! I have a 2 iron bent 2 strong to 16. Below, you'll see the results. 16,822. I should have made the same swing with a 9 iron, to compensate for the lie, but did not.". Does that create the maximum distance for that ball speed? The average golfer hits a 7-iron to around 30 yards from the pin. For example, the first generation M2 5-iron has a loft of 21.5. Taking the destructive shot out of your game is key. St Louis, MO. In 11 starts since gaining his place at the top level, the 26-year-old has made four cuts, including a first-time-out 12th at the Fortinet, 10th in Bermuda (led after a first round 62), 22nd at the American Express 7th after day one) and top-30 at the Plantation Course last week. What the heck are they were talking about? I believe that you can't really bend your irons too much but to accommodate I am thinking of bending my AP2s 1 degree stronger and AP3s 1 degree weaker so that I have better gaping. After the back-to-back top-25s, he was a sneaky play at a long price for the Honda, but was never comfortable, withdrawing during the event with sinus issues. Decided to get lofts and lie's double checked on my irons for peace of mind and following a gap check session get them bent 2 degree strong to the original manufacturer loft spec. The drop off in make percentage from 3-6 feet and 6-9 feet is huge.

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